Author Topic: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle  (Read 23154 times)

Offline wytfut

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #45 on: December 10, 2018, 04:14:19 PM »
Yeah that gasket has been gone for a number of years now. So.... Just silicon...
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Offline mendonjo

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #46 on: December 12, 2018, 07:06:36 PM »
It looks like my seals won't get here till Friday - BTW was the throttle position I noted ok, 16% fully closed ?

Thanks!
Joe
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Offline mendonjo

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #47 on: December 12, 2018, 07:08:31 PM »
oops, I mean 11% on the TPS
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Offline Donkey Hotey

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #48 on: December 12, 2018, 10:48:52 PM »
I would like to also know what the procedure is for finding the zero position on the throttle position sensor. My first bike, with the factory tune and in my possession forever, registered 10 or 11% at closed throttle so I would assume you're also in the ballpark.

Somewhere in the ECU it does subtract that number off and knows what "closed throttle" looks like. If you ever had to replace the throttle body or sensor, I don't know if you just have to mechanically adjust the sensor to get to the same number or if there is some other method. It'll never be a problem for most of us if we don't have to replace those parts.

Come to think of it: I don't know how our cars do that either. I don't know of any TPS reset method to find zero. They just seem to know.
Greg

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0738 since 2018 (Babe) 1940 since 2019 (Sinclair) 1555 since 2022 (Genesis)0315 since 2022 (Freedom)

Offline wytfut

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #49 on: December 13, 2018, 10:07:52 AM »
Tps and aic....    Both are a rare bird and are pretty much bullet proof so far
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Offline mendonjo

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #50 on: December 15, 2018, 03:10:21 PM »
It was a fruitful day.  The new seals arrived from Atlantic (including that rubber gasket they said was long gone) and I got to work.

Now there was a lot of work to be done because the exhaust was removed to get to the ground wires and such plus resealing the injectors and getting the intake back on.  Plus the exhaust hanger crack had been welded and I got a new air filter spacer that had been lost.

After a few hours I got everything buttoned up.  This was going to be it.  New seals and I was very careful with the reassembly.  Then when I finally went to fire it up...crap!  Still wont fire up but I can get it to run on the front cylinder if I keep enough throttle on.  Rear cylinder wont fire.  I did find the wires to the spark plug coil were exposed, well at least one of them.  I taped them up but that wasn't it.

I went to Autozone to get a compression tester to answer the question about compression but frankly I had pretty much decided the rear head must be cracked.  I bought a tester and the compression measured 135 psi, I didn't think that was too bad.

Then I'm checking the injector to the rear cylinder.  Maybe the connector is loose.  Nope.  I marked the connector with paint marker when I took things apart.  R2 for the second injector used for the rear cylinder.  Then I pull out the wiring diagram and realize I am either an idiot or have early onset.  I had connected the purge valve connector (used on CA models only) to the second injector.  Okay got that squared and...she fired right up.

It's raining right now so I can't take the bike for a spin.  But it fires right up and stays running just like it is supposed to.  This is a really good sign.

In conclusion what was it (assuming it stays fixed)?  An intake leak.  Possibly at the one of the heads or between the butterfly assembly and the intake.

When the rain lets up I will take it for a test drive but I'm pretty optimistic at this point.

Joe
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Offline wytfut

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #51 on: December 15, 2018, 04:32:38 PM »
Awesome sounds great ......
Yeah surprisingly some of those duetz connectors will interchange... Done that myself a couple of times.
.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2018, 11:34:13 PM by wytfut »
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Offline Jumper

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #52 on: December 16, 2018, 05:09:40 PM »
Well??!! Is it running o.k.?
Jumper

Offline Donkey Hotey

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #53 on: December 17, 2018, 11:24:44 PM »
Did you sell it this time? I think you just got through the woods and it was ready for some miles. I guess whatever your riding / ownership style is, this didn't fit into it?
Greg

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Offline mendonjo

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #54 on: December 22, 2018, 05:24:41 PM »
Hello Everyone.

Yes I took one last stab at selling the bike because the guy still had the 86 HD that I wanted.  The bike did sell but I realized the buyer did not have the money the same time I got a text from the HD guy saying it was sold.  I was really OK with that because I think I am through the woods on the Excelsior and I really wanted to enjoy it.  So, I'm back.

The bike still starts right up and settles into an low idle (750 RPM approx.) once the engine gets warm.  It's too cold to take it for a real ride but trips around the block suggest it's running exactly as it should.

I have a hunch my LH front motor mount is bad because it seems to have sunk down to the lower mounting bolt.  I posted the question on the facebook site because its easy to add pictures.  I will give a final update when I take the bike out on a ride long enough to get things hot to verify the flat spot is gone for good.

Joe
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Offline wytfut

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #55 on: December 22, 2018, 06:02:13 PM »
From your picture on Facebook not real sure if it's bad... But I posted some things to look at.
Another would be any knocking/ticking relavent to a sunken engine on the frame or cross frame.
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Offline mendonjo

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #56 on: December 22, 2018, 07:18:34 PM »
Thanks Bruce,

Someone suggested I remove the chrome caps and see if the bolt was centered in the hole.  I removed the caps, there was some rubber dust inside and the bolts were definitely not in the center.  The left one was at the bottom and the right one was only a little higher.  Looks like motor mount time :-[
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Offline Donkey Hotey

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #57 on: December 22, 2018, 11:28:17 PM »
You removed the caps "just because" or was it vibrating unusually badly? If the mounts are good, the bike will have what could best be described as soft vibration. If there's any hard hammering or shaking that you feel, the front mounts are probably bad.

They're just holding the engine with the rubber in shear. The mounting holes are offset to the top of the mount (not concentric) so that when they're loaded with the weight of the engine, the screws more or less end up in the center.

If the rubber fails, the screws are designed to let the engine drop down onto the spacer collars but, still keep everything where it belongs. It'll vibrate like hell but, nothing will fall off.

So if you see a gap between the bottom of the spacer collar (inboard of the socket head cap screws) and the surrounding metal housing, they're still hanging on. They might still be getting old though, and sagging more than they should.

As others have already suggested: they're a wear item. They go bad. Install them carefully (don't introduce any twist into them as you tighten) and they should last a long time.

And before some Harley dweeb tells you their bikes are different, Harley adopted very similar mounts, with all the same  pros and cons, quite a few years ago:

Greg

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Offline mendonjo

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #58 on: December 23, 2018, 06:07:35 AM »


I did also hear a faint clunk occasionally as I rode the bike around the block.  You can see rubber dust around the socket head cap screw
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Offline mendonjo

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Re: Bike stalls after starting up and flat spot off idle
« Reply #59 on: December 23, 2018, 06:13:10 AM »
I'm guessing from the discussions about longer chrome caps they must be functional.  Do they preload the rubber bushings in compression?

Joe
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